[HolyShadow]

Originally Posted by Mardigny

Questioning religion does indeed involve rational reasoning; believing the teachings of the religion does not. I don't see how you got 'reason therefore has a place in faith' from that particular quote.

Read my previous post about those who accept, and those who question their religion. One can obviously still apply reason to their faith and thus change their mind on issues while still believing the faith as a whole. There also exist people who just accept it.

I call your attention, however, to the statement you've made that questioning religion is rational whereas believing religion does not. Do you believe that the teachings of religion are all wrong, or do you think certain moral lessons from parables may benefit people in a real way? Furthermore, do you believe that the act of questioning in itself makes you a reasonable individual, regardless of whether or not your questioning ultimately leads you to believing in that religion?

The atheism movement does not encourage people to believe in non-belief, or whatever, because you wouldn't join it unless you already were an atheist (supposedly.) Just because atheism is a 'lack of something' doesn't mean there's not a movement. It is indeed has more of a public message behind it that encourages people to at least accept that some people are atheists, and should not be seen as immoral or in need of conversion; besides that, other ideals include maintaining a freedom of church and state (Jefferson) and stopping religious forces from committing horrid crimes, hate speech, and intolerance. The one thing I've honestly seen the people at atheist conventions really bash on is ignorance.

"Intolerance" is a tricky subject. I've seen cases wherein extreme atheist groups attempt to remove, say, statues from public parks because they display religious figures, and thus claim that to be intolerant. However, I can give most atheists the benefit of the doubt and state that I don't think they align with political atheists very much. As Fared has alluded to as a pressure group set on reform an activism, however, they do exist.

Personally I separate those who align in politics and those that align in philosophy differently, with philosophy representing an attempt to find the truth and politics referring to those who distort the truth for gains that may or may not be selfish.

Typically philosophical atheists are ones that have observed, considered, and made their choice, stating reason as their banner, and generally don't want to hassle people. There are many teenage atheists out there who think they have it all figured out, like there are many teenage homosexuals or heterosexuals who think they already know everything there is to know about their respective sexual orientations, but really they haven't experienced enough to really make that call. However, I feel like the ones politicized are inherently... the political ones. In that, I mean the ones who think they're right and try to force their being right down everyone else's throats without really realizing they act exactly as what they hate about mainstream religion.

I view philosophy as an eternal quest for the truth. I feel people who claim they've found the truth and don't question themselves at all are just... strange. I have a need to question myself constantly. As Fared said, I've matured.

I doubt either side is going to convince the other... but the idea that atheism is a religion really baffles me.

I used to think that it is indeed a religion, but that's before I reformed my way of thinking to philosophy being the central point.