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#61
05-11-2008
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I know that, but I merely feel like discussions that are mostly theological (i.e. the existence of God) are better left to their own topics.
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#62
05-11-2008
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Like I said, we have exhausted everything else, then this topic should die. But I want to keep it open and explore all the possible means to the beginning of life and the possibility's of life else where and the only way to keep that is by touching the touchy topic that has started wars.
But since that this is a forum, I do not believe that we need worry about the affects of nuclear war and ending all life as we know it. Then placing this discussion utterly pointless. No, we must then touch on "Is there really a God?". If you do not feel comfortable talking about this then you are free to leave this discussion at any time. Another joy and wonder of the internet forums.
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#63
05-11-2008
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It's not that I feel uncomfortable about it at all. In fact, it's just the opposite. The reason I'm trying to stay more strictly on topic is that topics that turn "religious" are often locked, and I would hate to lose such a (mostly) intelligent conversation.
I actually like to talk about religion quite a bit. I just didn't want the topic to be locked for us getting too far out from the actual "intelligent life" discussion. I will continue to post here regardless.
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#64
05-11-2008
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There are no rules that deem religious topics "wrong or against the rules". But if it leads to a flame war then thats why they get locked.
It seems as tho most of us that post in this topic have at least 2 brain cells, and do not take any offense from another users opinions but take it on board in order to broaden their own opinions. If it gets locked then I will protest against it as this is one of the only topics in the entire forums where it seems as tho there are some intelligent people here. The cloning topic sure sparked my interest but this one has more potential, along with a more interesting subject that has a much broader opinon factor. Making a more interesting topic.
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#65
05-11-2008
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Uh oh, someone has resorted to "you make yourself look like an idiot" argument.
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#66
05-11-2008
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That proves what?. You still have no evidence to say that God Does Not exist. You just showed me something about a kid and his pet Dragon.
That has no point to this topic what so ever, like I said if you do intend to join this conversation, please use facts based on the discussion. Otherwise do not post here. How hard is that to understand. Your logic is "If there is no evidence then it is wrong" My Evidence is the bible. Your evidence is a story about a kid and his invisible dragon. My evidence proves that God Exists Your evidence proves that the kid may or may not really have a real dragon. By your logic there is a God.
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#67
05-11-2008
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I have heard of this analogy before, but when referencing religion, it's a bit fallacious. It doesn't do anything toward disproving the very existence of God; it just strongly suggests that you should not entirely trust claims that invisible creatures are living among humans. Since God doesn't live among humans, anyway, this wouldn't work so well.
All your argument seems to say is, if I cannot experience it with my senses, or with modern tools to heighten senses, it does not exist. Following that logic, it would have been perfectly fine for people who have never used microscopes to deny the existence of microscopic particles, simply because they could not experience it for themselves. One way or another, human beings still do not know everything there is to know about our universe. God is not something humans can fully understand, in my belief. The Bible is one compilation of testimony that something above and beyond us exists; it is one of many such compilations created throughout history. So to use such a fallacious argument, refusing to even hear the testimony, is very one-sided and parochial. That is just my opinion.
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#68
05-11-2008
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My Problem with the Big bang is where did the particles that caused the big bang come from?
So the only logical answer I can come up with is "a higher power i.e. God. That asks a new question where did God come from. Common answer "Hes always there" Yeah ok that makes perfect sense. So by that definition there is no beginning. God just one day opened his eyes, and there it was just like a brand new house. A universe with nothing in it, "hmm" he thought to him self. "Lets make atoms and Molecules and see what happens. *Bang* The Universe just appeared. You see I can never think how it all started because to me both Creatism and The Big Bang theory (Not the popular Tv show) work together. But then how did it all start? why did it all start? Since we have covered the topic on The big bang and evolution, lets now look into the topic about Creatism and what it really means. Lets face it The Big Bang and Evolution go together, so Creatism and we just being humans go together. Unless we can find out how Evolution and Creatism come together. Since we can not really have originated from two people (Adam and Eve), or can we? Two people have massive families that spread to this day over billions of people? Or does Adam and Eve just stand for Man and Woman, how many did he make? Then where are the Dinosaurs? how do they fit it, I Have never read about them in the bible yet we have their fossiles and bones. Did they not mention them in the bible because they had not discovered them at the time and the people that wrote the bible had not imagined such large beasts?. So therefore was the bible just made up by a group of people that god bored and drunk one night? since then it has become the most popular book in history. Please answer and elaborate on my questions. Towards the end of this topic we shall compare Creatism and The Big bang theory properly at the end so we may make a more concice conclusion.
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#69
05-11-2008
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ARGUMENT FROM INTELLIGENCE
(1) Look, there's really no point in me trying to explain the whole thing to you stupid Atheists — it's too complicated for you to understand. God exists whether you like it or not. (2) Therefore, God exists.
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#71
05-11-2008
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Sorry? I did not intend to insult you.
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#73
05-11-2008
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It's called a non-sequiteur, man.
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#74
05-11-2008
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It seems you have nothing realistic to add to this discussion any way so why do you bother? Like I said please do not post here, I do not want this topic locked because of a flame war you are trying to start.
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#75
05-11-2008
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You know, when I mentioned God, I was simply trying to point out that whether you listen only to science or religion, that both sides give the possibility.
*Science, with no matter how high the odds, the odds are equal through out the universe, and that we were not special, and that there must be other planets with Intelligent life much like are own. *Religion, as far as Judaism and Christianity are concerned, I have not heard of any writing denying life outside of earth. I've heard about a verse that something like ". . . The Lord went on to create a thousand other worlds" which could mean he create life elsewhere in the universe. I think that verse is somewhere in the writings of the prophets. And look Henriksson, your argument that there's no God doesn't tie into the conversation at all. Unless you're going to give a scientific reason whether there is, or isn't Intelligent life, please do not bother us. Anyway, more the subject. A question of there being Intelligent life is how far along are they. Do you think there's any race out there that has the ability of Intergalactic travel without Time dilation? Or you do think they may still be in the "1950's" of sorts.
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#77
05-11-2008
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No, I didn't read Steven hawking's lecture yet, but I bookmarked it for later.
And I've could have easily said Stone Age, Bronze Age, or Medieval Period. I don't know, I think it would be funny for us to one day accomplish Intergalactic travel, go to a planet with Intelligent life, and find that they're decades or even centuries behind us. Since most people think of super-advanced beings when they think of life elsewhere in the universe.
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#78
05-11-2008
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Wow, this sure has taken off without me. Forgive my back-tracking, but I want to address a few points that have been brought up earlier.
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As for the advancement of hypothetical life forms, I think it would be much more plausible if they had evolved into something completely different than humans. They may even have evolved beyond the need for technology. For their civilization to progress the same way humans have, a myraid of factors would have to remain constant, such as their capacity for greed and violence. The history of mankind is filled with wars and oppression. It would be very interesting to study a civilization that was not so aggressive.
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#79
05-19-2008
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But natural selection i actually dont beleive in any more i heard evidence elsewhere that proved me wrong. I stand by my adaptation claim because how could you explain all the different races of humans? I also beleive maybe that all the other worlds were when god was like," no this one sucks...no...no...ahh lets have this one next to those ones..." and so on. We need darkarcher in here. He is the most religious person on here most likely.
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#81
05-21-2008
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Ok sorry for this I don't like going all religious in threads...
God wanted us to have free will. He didn't want to force us to do things he wants. He wants us to make our own things. God won't interfere with the things that are big like war. He knows the outcome anyways. He helps us through other people and others don't even notice it. We can make things better ourselves but god isn't going to snap his fingers and make it all better.
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#82
05-22-2008
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I think one of the best arguments against the existance of God is the amount of "wasted space" in the universe. If we are God's chosen people, why do we live in a small corner of a near infinite universe? On top of that, why do we live on a planet that is 90% uninhabitable by humans? Why would God create so much extra stuff in the universe if earth was the most important planet?
Alien life dosen't make sense from a religious standpoint. I think we should focus more on the scientific aspect of this topic.
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#83
05-22-2008
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Anyway, back to the scientific perspective. I still find the odds of any second form of intelligent life existing in the universe to be practically impossible.
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#89
05-23-2008
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Well, I don't really see the point of arguing any longer if nobody else beleives in a biblical point of veiw except for DarkArcher. The scientific aproach and the biblical approach are two entirely different things. There is no place in between.
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#90
05-23-2008
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